Falling birth rates

[tagh]

To clarify, pensions of government employees should not be available until the state pension age, and they should be linked to the average private pension, this includes local authority employees. ( exceptions for health problems, of course). By expecting these people to work longer we reduce the need for foreign labour and for pensions bleeding the people dry.
And, the only time I was a Civil Servant type employee I was ashamed of the work practices, laziness and fiddles by these employees, right up to senior staff.

[Wilbro]

@DominicBest
The point is that Native Americans certainly didn't speak English, Spanish or any other European language. They could make the same argument that your friend is now making.

[Blaze]

I believe the armed forces and police have their own pension schemes which are in a different "pot" to the state pension. Their working lives cannot be reasonably compared with that of a 9 to 5 office working civil servant. They may get generous pensions but who can begrudge them that since they pay in more than those who pay in for the state pension.

By expecting these people to work longer we reduce the need for foreign labour and for pensions bleeding the people dry.

The civil servants you mention are probably home-grown rather than "foreign labour" and other sectors, such as hospitals and agriculture, would not survive without "foreign labour".

[Pathca]

It was always said that the police pension was so generous because retired officers didn’t live many years to claim it having worked shifts all their lives they didn’t live a long time after
Also the personal contribution to a police pension is very high which means a lot are opting out and so reducing their future payout

[Blaze]

Agreed Pathca. We know several servicemen and police officers who haven't made old bones and lived to enjoy their pensions.

[tagh]

It is not a question of having a pension but when it can be accessed; as things stand, UK cannot afford the immense burden of public sector pensions ( it is worse in France). By making them available ate the same time as the OAP, and by insisting that folk have to work longer before they get them, there will be workers who can work in other sectors.
Those wishing to have private pensions in addition would be free to do so.
Remember that there are 1.5 million claiming unemployment and other benefits, many of whom have simply left the labour market and 900,000 vacancies.
Of course this would work hand in hand with proper evaluation of State paid workers and their jobs which should free up many more folk.
France would love to do this but State workers are guaranteed jobs for life with little evaluation of what they are doing, particularly in local and regional government but not exclusively.

[Blaze]

@tagh If you were insisting that everyone should work the same number of years in order to qualify for a pension, I might agree with you. But would insisting a policeman or serviceman work for another 20 years on top of his 30 years be reasonable or acceptable unless everyone was to be obliged to work for 50 years ?

Remember that there are 1.5 million claiming unemployment and other benefits, many of whom have simply left the labour market and 900,000 vacancies.

Perhaps those 900,000 vacancies could be filled by "foreign labour" ?? Or have I misunderstood ?

[Chappers51]

Remember that people in public service (my experience is within education) can opt to retire early and take a reduced pension. I know of many who opted to do that, but only because I had access to my staffing lists and controlled the budget.

Please don’t label everyone in the same way, some of those to whom you refer might chosen to retire earlier for personal and/or health reasons or indeed to help with staffing reductions.

[tagh]

As regards police and military personnel, I would suggest that fitness should be a criterion; many roles are not frontline and could be fulfilled by older staff.

To deal with a comment made earlier, I do not see that the suggestions I have made are right wing though they do go against the received wisdom of the Left.

[Pathca]

A

As regards police and military personnel, I would suggest that fitness should be a criterion; many roles are not frontline and could be fulfilled by older staff.

Actually certainly in policing that happens a lot